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Lance
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PostSubject: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 14th 2010, 22:37

2. Passing Minimum/Maximum Price Laws

This law needs to be top order of priority. Once valuations are set, goods will no longer be sold below the set value or above a set value. This serves two functions.

1. Ensures that all field owners make 20.00 wage per harvest
2. Ensures that all workshop owners make 25.00 wage per day of work

If goods are listed beyond these set parameters, town traders or mayors are authorized to buy these good and either prosecute the individual, re-list the goods at a higher price, or use for county trade. By listing your goods lower then the minimum price, you're only hurting yourself by missing out on the 20.00-25.00 wage.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 16th 2010, 12:05

This is pretty straightforward, want to have some other people look at min/max prices though. The Standard Valuation I came up with sets all goods at the price where they made the 20 field wage and the 25 workshop wage.
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Sullihan



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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 20th 2010, 22:24

If you don't enforce a price floor as well what's the point? Through competition people will drive down the prices to a point that no one will be able to make the decent wages you're trying to create...though I don't know how exactly you would enforce a floor...
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 21st 2010, 12:57

Enforcing price floors is somewhat difficult. You more or less just need the majority of people cooperating and make sure the Mayor is staying on top of their citizens to do it. The benefits are clear, everyone gets a better wage, it's not like we're doing this to be mean to people. I don't know if the price of prosecuting people (point wise) is worth it, but maybe a few early example, just to show people we're serious about enforcing this. Part of this is having active traders in town that can take advantage of under-priced goods people might put up below the minimum prices. Something to try if nothing else . . .
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Sullihan



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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 21st 2010, 18:29

Well when prosecuting for such cases you could fine them through wood the cost of the points. I think the key to the whole wage control plan will be an overload of information on our part pointing to how all this control will benefite the average Joe. Graphs are always good Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 22nd 2010, 07:37

Hopefully people wont need to drop their prices through the floor, i hope to use the courts to scare anyone who does, but people will soon see what sells and what doesnt, if its a low price the county will buy it up to trade, even with stagnated markets our low prices can beat others and still turn a good profit, the other fields which dont have such cheap goods well they will just have to even out their production so they all sell.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 26th 2010, 01:54

This is probably the toughest part of the whole program for the average person to swallow. Also it's the hardest to enforce. We do need to talk this up a bunch and spin it positively before the election. Make sure we point out how it benefits both them and the county. The optimal prices I came up with, really aren't exceedingly low either and it will give the County some room to export excesses.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 29th 2010, 16:33

Minimum/Maximum Price Laws

We will be passing minimum/maximum price laws in the short term in an attempt to reorganize town markets. This serves a two fold purpose. This ensures that all field owners make at least a 20.00 wage and all workshop owners make a 25.00. Secondly, that ensures a good supply of cheap goods that Council can export. Now this doesn't mean that you'll be working your fields and workshop everyday, we need town level planning and we will be pushing all mayors to organize production to cut back on overproduction.

I know, at first glance, this probably seems unpopular. I can only reiterate the mantra of our party, we must work together or we will fall. Trust us, this will work to benefit both the individual and the county if you will cooperate with it. Really, what do you have to lose? You already have a backlog of goods that aren't selling and you're making terrible daily wages, why not at least try this method? Willing participation is key here, however, we will not hesitate to use the law to enforce this initiative. But really, it's not about fining people or excreting control, it's about getting overproduction under control and prices where they need to be. Once again this benefits both the individual and the county. If we continue to just do whatever we want and each of us goes in a separate direction the debt will never go away. We need to unify ourselves in the face of all the odds stacked against us and sacrifice a bit of personal freedom, for the overall good of the county.

Quote :
Minimum/Maximum Prices will be as follows:

General Goods
Corn - 2.90
Wheat - 10.00
Fish - 17.00
Hides - 15.00
HHW - 15.45
Vegetables - 8.50
Wood Bushels - 2.85
Wool - 12.00

Baker
Bread - 4.65

Blacksmith
Blunted Axe - 108.25
Blunt Sword - 147.90
Buckets - 43.25
Knives - 15.40
Non-Forged Blade - 46.10
Sharpened Axe - 133.25
Steel - 48.95
Sword - 172.90
Sword Blade - 73.95
Unsharpened Blade - 73.95

Butcher
Meat (HHW) - 18.50

Carpenter
Boat - 114.25
Hulls - 33.55
Large Ladders - 80.70
Oars - 27.85
Shafts - 9.30
Small Ladders - 27.85
Unhooped Bucket - 27.85

Miller
Flour - 12.50

These are just the base values for most goods, think they work well as minimum prices. I don't know what Alistair wanted to do with Max prices, so I'll let him comment on that. Give any suggestions on these prices though or what you think they should be at min/max wise. Also feel free to add or edit my rhetoric posts Razz, trying to formalize this stuff for the platform.
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Sullihan



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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 29th 2010, 20:38

General Goods
Corn - 2.90

This gives around 20 pounds profit per harvest with two 20 pound max stat jobs.

Wheat - 10.00

Gives 30 pound per harvest with 20 poun max stat jobs.

Fish - 17.00

Are we going to be exporting fish at that price?

Hides - 15.00
HHW - 15.45
Vegetables - 8.50

It'll take some serious enforcement of the market laws to get vegetables even close to that price...but it gives 34 pounds per harvest at this price.

Wood Bushels - 2.85

That doesn't even give a 15 pound wage per day with a 5 wood day, did you mean 3.85?

Wool - 12.00

Baker
Bread - 4.65

Bread this low could cause corn to clog up the markets as the two usually compete for basic food.

Blacksmith
Blunted Axe - 108.25
Blunt Sword - 147.90
Buckets - 43.25
Knives - 15.40
Non-Forged Blade - 46.10
Sharpened Axe - 133.25

minimum price you can put it up on market for is 140.

Steel - 48.95
Sword - 172.90
Sword Blade - 73.95
Unsharpened Blade - 73.95

Butcher
Meat (HHW) - 18.50

Carpenter
Boat - 114.25
Hulls - 33.55
Large Ladders - 80.70
Oars - 27.85
Shafts - 9.30
Small Ladders - 27.85
Unhooped Bucket - 27.85

Miller
Flour - 12.50

We definitely need to start putting out the platform soon so we have time to explain it all before elections in 30 days.


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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 29th 2010, 20:54

Sullihan wrote:
General Goods
Corn - 2.90

This gives around 20 pounds profit per harvest with two 20 pound max stat jobs.

I think corn is good at that price

Wheat - 10.00

Gives 30 pound per harvest with 20 poun max stat jobs.

Wheat farmers made ridiculously good money, however the game only lets you sell it for 10.00 so no point making the minimum price lower then that.

Fish - 17.00

Are we going to be exporting fish at that price?

I've had personal success selling fish in Ayr and Galloway for 18.00 +. It's something to look into though. I can go snoop around lavabo and see what prices are near us.

Hides - 15.00
HHW - 15.45
Vegetables - 8.50

It'll take some serious enforcement of the market laws to get vegetables even close to that price...but it gives 34 pounds per harvest at this price.

Wood Bushels - 2.85

That doesn't even give a 15 pound wage per day with a 5 wood day, did you mean 3.85?

Er . . . maybe, I'll have to go back and look. Keep in mind these are just minimum prices too. Doesn't mean people can't list their goods for higher then this. Some thing with bread, I don't actually expect anyone to want to sell their bread for 4.65. Some goods need minimum prices, some other goods need maximum price caps more.

Wool - 12.00

Baker
Bread - 4.65

Bread this low could cause corn to clog up the markets as the two usually compete for basic food.

Blacksmith
Blunted Axe - 108.25
Blunt Sword - 147.90
Buckets - 43.25
Knives - 15.40
Non-Forged Blade - 46.10
Sharpened Axe - 140.00

minimum price you can put it up on market for is 140.

Fixed Very Happy.


Steel - 48.95
Sword - 172.90
Sword Blade - 73.95
Unsharpened Blade - 73.95

Butcher
Meat (HHW) - 18.50

Carpenter
Boat - 114.25
Hulls - 33.55
Large Ladders - 80.70
Oars - 27.85
Shafts - 9.30
Small Ladders - 27.85
Unhooped Bucket - 27.85

Miller
Flour - 12.50

We definitely need to start putting out the platform soon so we have time to explain it all before elections in 30 days.

And yeah, that's why I was writing these up. Also finalized what we wanted on the law revisions. So both those sections are ready to go. That covers all the economic/judicial stuff we wanted to do. Now we just need to get military stuff together. That isn't really my strong suite by far. I'll let whoever else handle that. Just give me a figure of how much money you'll need Razz.

I'm going to go kick Hespera, Jethro, Ceana, and a few others to get in here again and comment. Would like to get this out by next Monday at the latest, also would like to have the list up by then.
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Sullihan



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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 29th 2010, 21:02

Quote :
Er . . . maybe, I'll have to go back and look. Keep in mind these are just minimum prices too. Doesn't mean people can't list their goods for higher then this. Some thing with bread, I don't actually expect anyone to want to sell their bread for 4.65. Some goods need minimum prices, some other goods need maximum price caps more.

I would think we would want the minimum prices set so that they would already make their 20 pound per day field/25 pound per day workshop/18 pounds per day max stat, but that's just me Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 29th 2010, 21:08

Well the way I see it . . . and this is just my mindset . . .

say the price cap on bread is 5.50 (just throwing out a number). People are naturally going to try to undercut each other to sell their bread quicker. I'm just telling them they can't sell it for lower then 4.65 in that process, because that's where they stop making at least 20.00.

As for wood . . . no idea where I got that number from, lol. Going to rework the figures on that.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 29th 2010, 21:10

That works too Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 30th 2010, 16:16

The only restrictions I like on a market is corn and bread and that is for MAX prices. I don't like least price caps at all.. I like a free market other than the two staples.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   September 30th 2010, 21:25

If there's no market control then the whole system we're working on falls apart...we've seen what little/no control markets do the economy why not play around with something else?
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 1st 2010, 12:05

Because I don't want my freedom taken from me. That is why. Wink
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 1st 2010, 12:51

The market's freedom, not yours Wink

Free markets in now way help the county, they just exist.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 1st 2010, 17:04

Then we agree to disagree.

I don't want it dictated to me what I can and can not sell my goods for. It is my freedom I am losing if I am not able to sell my goods for my prices.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 1st 2010, 17:47

The problem is Ceana if you undercut someone and lose out they also have to lower it to actually sell, which isnt fair on you or them. Then theres the issue of people taking advantage of the market to make more money which isnt fair on other people. Anyway this way it makes trading so much easier, we can bulk buy off the market for trade and prices wont go up whereas if you did that now they would.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 2nd 2010, 09:34

Perhaps it would be worth considering this approach against just having extremely active Mayors working with their citizens to have dedcated people working on providing different foods and goods. I'm so neutral in this issue, its annoying.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 2nd 2010, 17:19

Well mayors already work with their constituents on what fields and workshops to pick, I think that's what you're talking about Mercury. But when there becomes too many good producers and not enough users then a more active hand in the market needs to be taken. Active mayors and mentors advising worked wonders when Scotland had a booming and growing population, but with an aging population just that isn't enough.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 2nd 2010, 23:33

Ceana wrote:
Then we agree to disagree.

I don't want it dictated to me what I can and can not sell my goods for. It is my freedom I am losing if I am not able to sell my goods for my prices.

Aye Ceana, I know this is something you feel passionate about. But we need to do this to insure that we have complete control of the senate . . . I mean, we have a good economic set up. Seriously though, Ceana, what if I made this offer to you?

3 days a week I can guarantee you will make between 20.00-25.00 daily (via working in your workshop, or working other people's fields) and county would buy whatever goods you produce in a reasonable amount of time at the county prices. The other four days I would ask you to work in the mine making 15.50, part out of duty to the county. That is between 122.00-137.00 weekly. In exchange all you have to do is agree to sell your bread between 5.50 and 4.75. Would you take that offer?

Or you could work all 7 days in someone elses field for roughly 16.00 and make 112.00. Or split time in the mines, making say 16.00 3 days and 15.50 4 day for 110.00, a full 10.00-12.00 less per week, but you can list your goods for whatever you want and take your chances on how fast they will sell. On top of that you also hurt the county, by not providing a pool of cheap goods for us to export.

Option 1 just makes more sense in my mind. I know this sounds like I am being a dictator and just want control, but that's not it entirely. I want it to the point where our citizens are making more money and the county has cheap goods to export. I think it's win, win . . .

Quote :
Perhaps it would be worth considering this approach against just having extremely active Mayors working with their citizens to have dedcated people working on providing different foods and goods. I'm so neutral in this issue, its annoying.

That's what I mean about staying on top of the Mayors. We need organized production in the towns. No, not everyone should work their shops and fields as often as they want. First off that takes workers away from the mines, secondly that leads to overproduction. That can lower prices as people try to undercut each other, but through that they make less money off their goods, sometimes it doesn't even cover the cost of hiring out the fields. So people are producing just for the heck of it and that is killing us. People posting senseless amount of jobs in the TH and working their shops instead of the mines. If you have 6 butchers in town, figure out how much meat you need on a weekly basis (between what your town consumes and what CC will buy for export). Then maybe you start a rotation, two of your butchers work one week, make 25.00 quickly off it, then next week 2 other butchers produce and so on. There everyone gets to work their shops and fields still, but it's organized so that we still have enough mine workers and we don't overproduce.
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 3rd 2010, 10:51

Quote :
3 days a week I can guarantee you will make between 20.00-25.00 daily (via working in your workshop, or working other people's fields) and county would buy whatever goods you produce in a reasonable amount of time at the county prices. The other four days I would ask you to work in the mine making 15.50, part out of duty to the county. That is between 122.00-137.00 weekly. In exchange all you have to do is agree to sell your bread between 5.50 and 4.75. Would you take that offer?

Or you could work all 7 days in someone elses field for roughly 16.00 and make 112.00. Or split time in the mines, making say 16.00 3 days and 15.50 4 day for 110.00, a full 10.00-12.00 less per week, but you can list your goods for whatever you want and take your chances on how fast they will sell. On top of that you also hurt the county, by not providing a pool of cheap goods for us to export.

That would look really good on the platform as explaining the benefits of the changes Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 3rd 2010, 11:17

With a debt, how can you make promises that you will buy my goods? Because I would like to know how that works...

Nah.. I am hesitant for a reason.. because a red flag is popping up in my mind. Why, I haven't figured out yet, but my gut instincts are usually spot on. Wink
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PostSubject: Re: 2. Minimum/Maximum Price Laws   October 3rd 2010, 11:20

Taxes will go into cash grant which will be used to buy up goods and trade them, this money will just grow grow and grow as time goes on making more and more money for the county, it will require a lot of grants etc but it can be managed.
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